Host: Catherine Burns

Catherine: [00:00:01] This is The Moth Podcast. I'm Catherine Burns. This week, we're celebrating one of our most beloved Moth family members, Anthony Griffith. 

In 2003, The Moth did a series of shows at the now defunct US Comedy Arts Festival in Aspen, Colorado. The cast of both shows was made up of comedians who were coming to the festival to perform their comedy sets, and Anthony was asked to tell a story in the first show. Anthony is one of the funniest people I know, but the story he wanted to tell was anything but. Our then artistic and executive director, Lea Thau, directed his story and he told her that he wanted to talk about something no one in the comedy world knew about him up until that point. 

The recording you're going to hear is actually the audio pulled off a camcorder I snuck into the venue under a big ski jacket. We weren't supposed to record the stories that night, but we couldn't stand not having at least a record of the show. I'm not usually a big rule breaker, but I'm so glad I rebelled that afternoon. 

We're playing Anthony's story, because he has a beautiful new book out that we wanted to call attention to. More on that afterwards, here's Anthony Griffith, live at The Moth. 

[applause] 

Anthony: [00:01:14] Charles Dickens classic A Tale of Two Cities starts off with the phrase, “It was the best of times and it was the worst of times.” 1990, I moved from Chicago with my family to LA to seek my fame and fortune. And in a couple of weeks of being there, I got two important phone calls. One was from the talent coordinator for The Tonight Show, offering me to have a spot as a comedian on Tonight's Show. And the second call was that my daughter's doctor had called up to say that her cancer had resurfaced. A year prior, she was diagnosed with cancer, and we fought it, and it went into remission and now it's back. 

And for that next year, my life was pretty surreal, because it's like two different personalities. During the day, in order to keep my daughter at home with me, I would have to learn CPR and how to work a heart monitor and administer medicine, all these technical terms, and take her back and forth, excuse me, to get her platelets and blood and check up on her. And at night, I would go from club to club with the talent coordinator and I would work on my set and try to perfect it. I would meet veterans like George Wallace and Seinfeld and Roseanne. I thought that everything was great, because we had beat the cancer before, we could beat it again. And this was the first time that I was going to be in front of millions of people on The Tonight Show. 

And the first time on The Tonight Show I was extremely nervous. All I could think about while I was backstage being introduced was, “Don't mess up. Just don't mess up. Whatever you do, don't mess up.” And the curtains open, and there's 600 people, and the cameras, and Johnny's over there and the band is over there. I don't know what I said for the next six minutes, [audience laughter] but I got six applause breaks. The great part of that night, was that I was going to my car and I met Johnny, who was going to his car. It was just a private moment between us in the parking lot of him saying, “You were very funny. You were extremely funny. Start working on your second Tonight Show, because I want you back.” 

By the time I get the official call for my second Tonight Show, my daughter [sobs] 

was admitted to the hospital. If you don't know about cancer, when it comes back, it comes back hard. It's like beating up a gang banger for the first time and then it's coming back. And he's coming back meaner and stronger and he's coming with his friends. So, in order to compensate for that, you have to raise the chemo and you have to raise the medicine and you have to raise the radiation, which is difficult for an adult but she was only two. 

So, she's bald, which she doesn't mind, because every kid in the ward is bald. And she thinks this is part of life. She can't keep her foot down. [sobs] You're not prepared for this. There's no books, there's no home-ed class to teach you how to deal with this. And you can't go to a therapist, because in the black world, a therapist is taboo. It's reserved for rich white people. So, you're trying to figure it out, what did I do? Maybe it's something I did. Maybe it's something my wife did. Maybe my doctor diagnosed it erroneously something. 

But at night, I still have to be a comic. I have to work on The Tonight Show, because that's what I'm going to do. I'm a clown. I'm a clown whose medical bills are raising who's one step from being evicted, who's one step from getting his car repo and I have to come out and make you laugh, because no one wants to hear the clown in pain, because that's not funny. 

My humor is becoming dark, and it's biting and it's becoming hateful. The talent coordinator has seen that there's a problem, because the NBC is all about nice and just everything is going to be okay and we're starting to buck horns, because he wants everything light. I want to be honest and tell life, and I'm hurting and I want everybody else to hurt, because somebody is to blame for this. So, I buck up and I suppress my anger and I form and develop a nice, cute routine for the second Tonight Show. And I get applause breaks and I get asked to come back for a third time.

I'm perfecting my third set, and the doctor asked me to come in. I know something's wrong, because even the doctor is crying. And doctors don't cry. And he said that “We've done all we can. There's nothing else for us to do.” And I said, “How much time does she have?” And he said, “At the most, six weeks.” And I should plan for that. I'm thinking, how do I plan for that? I haven't planned to buy her first bicycle. I haven't planned to walk her to school. I haven't planned to take pictures of her on her prom. I haven't planned to walk her down the aisle to get married. How am I going to plan to buy her a dress to be buried in? 

I'm trying to keep it together, because I'm the man, and I'm the man of the house and I don't want to cry, but it's coming. I'm trying to tell my way, tell myself, Tony, I'm trying to beg the world, just give me a chance. Just give me chances. Just let me take a breath. Just stop. Just for a minute. I want to call my parents and tell them what do I do. I don't know what to do. I'm a grown man, and I don't know what to do. And a man voicing me comes up like Denzel from Training Day, “Man up, nigga up. You think you're the only one losing kids today? 25 kids walked in here with cancer, only 5 walking out. This ain't no sitcom. It don't wrap up all nice and tidy in 30 minutes. This is life. Welcome to the real world.” 

And he was right. So, I bucked up, because that's what I'm supposed to do. And on my third Tonight Show, by that time, my daughter had died and I had six applause breaks that night. No one knew I was mourning. No one knew that I could care less about The Tonight Show or Johnny Carson. In 1990, I had three appearances with the legendary Johnny Carson and a total of 14 applause breaks. I would have given it all if I could just have one more day sharing a bag of French fries with my daughter. It was the best of times, it was the worst of times. Thank you. 

[applause]

Catherine: [00:10:15] That was Anthony Griffith. Anthony is a comedian and actor who won an Emmy Award for his outstanding performance in the television drama, Our Father, and who oscillates between stage, film and television. Anthony cowrote a book with his wife, Dr. Brigitte Travis-Griffin, called Behind the Laughter: A Comedian’s Tale of Tragedy and Hope which came out this past-Tuesday. The book picks up where his Moth story left off during one of the most trying times in his life. 

I spoke to Anthony to follow up on this story and to talk about his brand-new book. Anthony has MS. And so, his voice shakes a little bit when he speaks. Here's my conversation with Anthony. 

Catherine: [00:10:54] So, Anthony, wow. We met back in 2003, over 16 years ago. 

Anthony: [00:10:59] Yes. 

Catherine: [00:11:00] I was producing some Moth shows at the US Comedy Arts Festival in Aspen. So, we were at a comedy festival. But you wanted to tell a story about a haunting dark period in your life. Do you remember why you wanted to tell the story so badly back then? 

Anthony: [00:11:17] You know, back then, we all were young, your organization, The Moth, and myself-- I had not told this story to anyone and my daughter, who had been deceased, spoke to me and said, “Tell my story.” And that was the very first time I ever told it. And so, Lea brought me to a room to share and after about a minute she was crying, I was crying. So, she just said, “Stop. We'll just wait till tomorrow, so you can tell the story fully.” But that was the very first time that I told someone that I had a daughter who had passed, because I'm a very private person. So, I kept that to myself. 

We just moved out to California and we didn't know a lot of people. So, I didn't tell my friends, I didn't tell my manager, I didn't tell my agent. It was just a secret that my wife and I kept to ourselves. Yeah.

Catherine: [00:12:39] So, I'm going to go back into that night-- So, do you remember what it felt like to be on stage? It was that tiny little room, because they put us on during-- at 3 o’clock in the afternoon when everybody was skiing. So, there were probably only like 60 in people in the audience. 

Anthony: [00:12:55] I thought it was maybe 20. I think I was thinking of me, so I really don't really remember a lot. I remember Bill Burr story, because I thought that was real good, and he really opened up. So, a lot of comics who shared their stories, I was just amazed that we were in a situation that we opened up. I don't think we would have ever done it if we didn't feel grounded, and in an intimate place of trust and stuff like that. 

Catherine: [00:13:41] Well, I remember Janeane Garofalo actually headlined the show, and we had to make her go on early. Like, she totally agreed to it when she heard what your story was about, because we knew that no one could follow you. So, do you remember how it felt afterwards? Like, what the reception was? 

Anthony: [00:14:00] I felt drained. A lot of the comics felt like, “Wow, it was very powerful.” People were crying. I really didn't know why. Again, I just told the story from my heart. Yeah, it's just people were moved by the story. That's all I can remember. I just remember feeling drained for the most part. Yeah.

Catherine: [00:14:39] That makes so much sense. One of the things I love about your story, is that even though obviously the heart of it is this enormous tragedy that you and your wife experienced, there is also quite a bit of humor in it, because you are so funny. I'm wondering if humor in general played a role in you processing the death of your daughter and this whole thing that you had to face so young. 

Anthony: [00:15:04] I think that for me and with other comics, humor does help us brace or come to grips with things that are very real to us. I think that's one way of us dealing with something with such traumatizing. I think I’ve always looked at the humor as something that helps me in times of-- I've had various family members that have passed, I've had friends that have passed and I think humor is definitely something I use as a tool to help me get through everything, help me digest it. 

Catherine: [00:16:01] So, tell me about your book. I'm so excited about your book, Anthony. 

Anthony: [00:16:05] Well, it's the book which I wrote it with my wife. It's about several things. One, it's for those who are going into the entertainment business. The good, the bad and the ugly side of It. It's a couple relationship book, because my wife and I will celebrate 33 years this year. 

Catherine: [00:16:37] Wow. Congratulations. 

Anthony: [00:16:39] I have a good friend who knew that we had a daughter that had passed, but he was reluctant to talk about his dog, because he doesn't have kids. But his dog died, and he bawled like a baby. I had to tell him, “Hey, grief has no specific. Yeah, grief is grief.” And I said, “Hey, I understand. That was like a child for you,” because he doesn't have children. 

Cathrine: [00:17:18] What do you hope readers will walk away with after reading Behind the Laughter? 

Anthony: [00:17:23] Well, I know with me, from the death of my daughter-- I want people to walk away with first of all, tomorrow is not promised. So, whatever you're going to do, go ahead and do it today. If you love someone, let them know today. The book will show a couple of things that we as humanity, as humans thrive-- I think I heard a pastor said, “We're battleship protected. We've been beaten, but we still run.” And it's good. 

You see someone who's 50, they've went through something. Somebody who's lost a loved one has went through something. You still can survive and flourish after that trauma. If you're married, you can still work it out. You can still have fun. You can look back and like you said, “Laugh at the fact.”

One of the big things in the book that I talk about was trying to comb my daughter's hair. She has so much hair. It was like, I didn't like combing her hair, she didn't like me combing her hair, so we agreed that I won't comb it and she won't ask me to comb it. It was just, “Hey, mom is just going to have to deal with it.” And so, hey, anyway, she wanted it done. I was fine with me. We went on about our business and stuff like that. I would take her to the comedy clubs, and the waitstaff would watch her. While I was on stage and sometimes, I would take her on stage with me in a baby chair or baby-- What do you call it? I don’t know. 

Catherine: [00:19:44] Like a little bassinet. Yeah, stroller bassinet. 

Anthony: [00:19:48] Yeah. And if she was asleep, I would just tell my jokes real quietly [Catherine laughs] and everybody in the audience would laugh, because they were in on the joke. For my daughter, “Hey, we're all going to be quiet because we don't want to wake her up.” 

Catherine: [00:20:06] Awe. 

Anthony: [00:20:07] And I thought that was special. With my wife being married 32 years, she knows my jokes better than I do. She makes me laugh as she's telling my jokes. She'll put her own twist on it, so it makes it funny. And to make a comic laugh is very hard and she does it on a daily-- We should go out as a team. In fact, she wants to put on the YouTube and have posts of the comic and the caretaker, like a Laurel and Hardy type of thing. Yeah.

Catherine: [00:20:57] That sounds like a hit. 

Anthony: [00:20:59] Yes. Yes. I'll have to get her permission. I think she wants a little more money, because she's the doctor now. Yeah, she's a doctor, but we'll have to negotiate. 

Catherine: [00:21:19] That was my interview with Anthony Griffith. You can find Anthony's book in stores and online now. That's all for this week on the podcast. We hope you'll join us next time. 

Jay: [00:21:30] Your host was The Moth's Artistic Director, Catherine Burns. 

Catherine: [00:21:33] Podcast production by Julia Purcell, with help from Annie Chelsea. The Moth Podcast is presented by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange, helping make public radio more public at prx.org.